Smooth distorted rhythm tone from bridge humbucker - Bill Lawrence Wilde-Gate - Gear Discussion - Fender Info-Base™ (F.I.B.™) - Message Board - Yuku

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Smooth distorted rhythm tone from bridge humbucker

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gatguy	Smooth distorted rhythm tone from bridge humbucker		Lead	[-]
Posts: 406 Mon, Feb 9, 2009 20:51:44 Contributing Silver Member	Tags : None I think Pete Townshend once said that you don't want to play fancy chords with distortion because the distortion effect itself creates a lot of extraneous harmonies in the chord. I'm not sure that's necessarily true. For example, have you ever noticed that when playing rhythm guitar with distortion, some bridge humbuckers will produce a smooth, fat, harmonious rhythm tone - even when playing complex chords - while others will sound rough and unruly with lots of extraneous harmonies that can overwhelm the musicality of the tone? The difference is especially obvious when playing complex chords, as Dr. Who suggested. The effect is not apparent when playing single note runs, nor does it respond much to my attempts to remove it by EQ-ing. I've been A/B-ing a number of bridge humbuckers in search of that smooth, fat, rhythm tone. My vintage L90 produces it quite well while my L500XL doesn't achieve the same degree of smoothness. Can anyone explain why different pickups vary in this characteristic and whether it's an inherent characteristic of the pickup or whether there are some useful tweaks to get a pickup to harmonise under distortion?
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PeteMK1		#1	[url]	[-]
Posts: 2169 Tue, Feb 10, 2009 20:00:34 Contributing Palladium Member Resident Electronics Guru	I think I know what you're talking about, such a tone is really useful and nice to have. My personal experience is that I got this type of tone with (humbucking) pickups that were actually supposed to go into the P90 direction. I have both BL and non-BL pickups of this kind. They have enough clarity and string separation, but are full and a bit "middy" sounding at the same time. L-500s have too much treble and bass for that, at least IMO. If you wouldn't get this tone from the old L90, I might have suspected that pole-pieced pickups are a better fit for that tone, but it probably depends more on the inductance of the pickup. A high inductance probably isn't helpful, but that's already a bit of speculation. You can say you to me.
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gatguy		#2	[url]	[-]
Posts: 407 Tue, Feb 10, 2009 21:46:15 Contributing Silver Member	Thanks Pete. Your speculations make a lot of sense. I also think that a lower inductance pickup is better for that type of tone - but I wouldn't go too low. The two pickups I tried that were smoothest were medium inductance (c. PAF levels e.g. vintage L90 and Ibanez Super 70) and those that were less smooth were higher output (L500XL and EMG 60). I will try rolling off the guitar volume pot a bit with the higher output pups. Back to EQ-ing... I read recently that attenuating the lows can work well for smoothing out the distortion. I also read that the use of a treble booster can do similar. Neither of these ideas had occurred to me because to my ear, it seemed that it was the high frequencies that generated the roughness. This is especially noticable when I let a distorted chord ring for a few seconds. However, I did try cutting the highs and that doesn't work too well. nevertheless, maybe I was wrong about EQ-ing. I'll try cutting the bass and boosting the treble. I also think that that type of tone cannot be generated easily at moderate volumes, when I rely mainly on pre-amp distortion... Power tube distortion/compression may be a key factor. I sure hope the neighbours are enjoying what I'm playing Any other ideas out there? Anybody got a full, smooth, distorted rhythm sound (smooth, tight, chunky chords that sustain nicely and don't break up) out of their bridge pickup? Which pickups work best and are there any tweaks that help?
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PeteMK1		#3	[url]	[-]
Posts: 2170 Wed, Feb 11, 2009 09:51:53 Contributing Palladium Member Resident Electronics Guru	Regarding the EQ: It's true that too much bass isn't helpful, since it makes the distorted tone muddy. As far as treble is concerned, I think that there's a fair amount needed for clarity, but too much of the really high treble frequencies seem to be a problem. Perhaps it's more of an "upper mids"-thing (at least in HiFi-terms). Another very important factor is the guitar itself. IMO, the basic timbre always shines through, no matter what pickups are used. FWIW, I get the best bridge pickup tone from a guitar with 25.5" scale, mahogany body, maple/rw neck, TOM bridge and Bigsby B-5 tremolo (helps a lot in the tone department!). The pickup is a P90-sized humbucker from DiMarzio (DLX series). You can say you to me.
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gonzo		#4	[url]	[-]
Posts: 156 Wed, Feb 11, 2009 16:42:59 Bronze Member	the idea behind the original 'tube screamer' (and all the clones since, which my favorite, the Barber DDSS pedal, is a staple on my board)..... is that the treble boost, also has a bass cut, and this 'tightens' the low end sound of your rig, for soloing. this works the best at stage volume, less so as you turn your rig down. but the effect is the same. it's a not so fancy eq, with the added gain boost, that 'cleans up' the distorted sound. i happen to like a little bass boost in my overdrive sound, so i have the DDSS, which has mini pots that you can set for bass, mids, presence, and harmonics. a brilliant little pedal. what they call the "tube screamer killer".
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ccrowley	My limited experience...	#5	[url]	[-]
Posts: 16 Wed, Feb 11, 2009 18:51:13	I've only used the L-500 XL for Lawrence humbuckers and still think they are top notch (probably my high gain tones that I've recorded). However, Bartolini's PBF-51 is a great PAF tone that w/ Fralin style volume kit cleans up to killer "vintage" crunch - with my rig it created a great rhythm tone. Bartolini's words -> The "49" and "51" provide much more focused and defined lows while retaining and improving the sweetnes of the high end. I agree. Definitely not fuzzy or farty. The PBF -77D is a bit bass heavy, L-500XL level output and I'm assuming the resonant peak is a bit different (not the vintage straight out of the box tone). Too bad there so flippin pricey.
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